Quoted from user23.3

Sorry, you're mistaken, Clay Hill Ward covers part of the parish of Shaw as well as Newbury.

I agree with Blackdog here. The Clay Hill ward map is here:

http://www.westberks.gov.uk/CHttpHandler.ashx?id=10184&p=0

Shaw-cum-Donnington parish council website has a description of their parish boundaries here:

http://www.shawcumdonnington.org.uk/theparish.php

They are completely separate. They share a boundary along Shaw Hill.

Quoted from user23.3

Perhaps I did, though councillors represent wards and that's what we were talking about, wards and which of them cover Newbury,

You were talking about walking to Victoria Park from Clay Hill, my point is that that is not the area at the bottom of the hill called Shaw.

Quoted from Wolfie

I agree with Blackdog here. The Clay Hill ward map is here:

Here's the Clay Hill Ward map with part of the parish of Shaw shown included in it at the top right, indicated by the black line.

http://ww2.westberks.gov.uk/In.....d=ONS&qin=10MBNR

Frankly it would be much more democratic and much fairer in community charge terms if these lottle parishes were absorbed into the Town.  Newbury Town Clay Hill Ward is a great example.  People living there can walk through the 'cheaper rated' Shaw to get to the Town's facilities.  This fringe area freeloading ought to stop.

Quoted from user23.3

Perhaps I did, though councillors represent wards and that's what we were talking about, wards and which of them cover Newbury,

Exactly - if you can vote for a Newbury town councillor you live in Newbury - all of Clay Hill Ward is in Newbury.

Quoted from blackdog

Exactly - if you can vote for a Newbury town councillor you live in Newbury - all of Clay Hill Ward is in Newbury.

But it doesn't solely cover Newbury Town as suggested.

Quoted from user23.3

But it doesn't solely cover Newbury Town as suggested.

What is Newbury Town then? In my book it is the place represented by Newbury Town Council - and hence Clay Hill Ward is part of Newbury Town - 100%.

Quoted from user23.3

Here's the Clay Hill Ward map with part of the parish of Shaw shown included in it at the top right, indicated by the black line.

http://ww2.westberks.gov.uk/In.....d=ONS&qin=10MBNR

The trouble with this map is that the word SHAW is not actually in Shaw, or Shaw cum Donnington to give the parish its full name. Part of Shaw is shown at the top left (the bit with Shaw House and Trinity in it). The boundaries have always been the River Lambourn (apart from the little park south of Shaw House) and the Hermitage Road. As I said before - most of what people consider to be Shaw is actually not in Shaw but in Newbury.

Historically the area of Clay Hill Ward was in Thatcham parish, in the part that was split off to create Cold Ash parish in the C19th. It must have been a fairly recent change that brought it into Newbury (1974 perhaps?).

Quoted from blackdog

What is Newbury Town then? In my book it is the place represented by Newbury Town Council - and hence Clay Hill Ward is part of Newbury Town - 100%.

No, you are mistaken. Newbury Town Council only covers the bit to the South of the black line at the top of Clay Hill (which is highlighted in yellow), which is the majority but not all of the West Berkshire Clay Hill Ward. The map shows the official boundaries.

You are all missing the point which was my original statement. Clay Hill is a very small area at the top of the Turnpike Road to the North of that road and east of Stoney Lane. It is a very small area. When the Newbury Wards were divied out, they called the whole lot, as shown in Yellow, the Clay Hill ward covering Turnpike Estate and the area South and West which is known nowadays as Shaw. If you look closely at that map linked earlier, Clay Hill is not even in the Clay Hill Ward. I suspect Clay Hill sounded a bit more upmarket than the Turnpike Ward given the social problems associated with that name.

Quoted from brian

You are all missing the point which was my original statement. Clay Hill is a very small area at the top of the Turnpike Road to the North of that road and east of Stoney Lane. It is a very small area. When the Newbury Wards were divied out, they called the whole lot, as shown in Yellow, the Clay Hill ward covering Turnpike Estate and the area South and West which is known nowadays as Shaw. If you look closely at that map linked earlier, Clay Hill is not even in the Clay Hill Ward. I suspect Clay Hill sounded a bit more upmarket than the Turnpike Ward given the social problems associated with that name.

Okay - I see where you are coming from - the Clay Hill Ward for WBC is different from the Clay Hill Ward for NTC.  But the extra bit in the WBC ward is not in Shaw - its in Cold Ash.

Phew, this was all about users It's easier to walk from Clay Hill to Victoria park than it is from Cold Ash. I agree but only on the assumption that Clay hill (geographic) is not at the bottom of Turnpike Rd/Kiln Road/Shaw Road but at the top.

Quoted from brian

Phew, this was all about users It's easier to walk from Clay Hill to Victoria park than it is from Cold Ash. I agree but only on the assumption that Clay hill (geographic) is not at the bottom of Turnpike Rd/Kiln Road/Shaw Road but at the top.

This was all about users attempt to divert us away from someone else who doesn't want the pavilion by saying they live outside Newbury.

One would assume that he would equally dissuade someone outside Newbury from speaking for or using said pavilion.

But of course he wouldn't be consistent like that, he likes WBC's attempts to not fulfil public opinion by manipulating the figures!!

Quoted from Nobby

This was all about users attempt to divert us away from someone else who doesn't want the pavilion by saying they live outside Newbury.

One would assume that he would equally dissuade someone outside Newbury from speaking for or using said pavilion.

But of course he wouldn't be consistent like that, he likes WBC's attempts to not fulfil public opinion by manipulating the figures!!

The argument that only Newbury residents should have an opinion is contrary to WBC's view.  For a start the decision to go ahead or not will be taken by WBC councillors - most of whom are not Newbury residents.

The aim of the Wharf development, of which the pavilion is a part, is to persuade people to come into Newbury and spend longer than just the time needed to do a bit of shopping. They hope that the area will be attrractive enough to draw people into Newbury. As such the opinions of those who live outside Newbury are vital in order to judge the potential of the scheme. If they prefer user's 'muddy corner' of the park to the pavilion it says a lot about the pavilion. At the very least they need to go back to the drawing board on this one - the consultation has not shown enough support for this design to justify the sacrifice of part of the park.  

Quoted from blackdog

The argument that only Newbury residents should have an opinion is contrary to WBC's view.  For a start the decision to go ahead or not will be taken by WBC councillors - most of whom are not Newbury residents.

The aim of the Wharf development, of which the pavilion is a part, is to persuade people to come into Newbury and spend longer than just the time needed to do a bit of shopping. They hope that the area will be attrractive enough to draw people into Newbury. As such the opinions of those who live outside Newbury are vital in order to judge the potential of the scheme. If they prefer user's 'muddy corner' of the park to the pavilion it says a lot about the pavilion. At the very least they need to go back to the drawing board on this one - the consultation has not shown enough support for this design to justify the sacrifice of part of the park.  

Brian's post referred to Newbury Town councillors, who don't cover Thirtover in Cold Ash.